Podcast questions
Can you choose a place that best represents how you are feeling today? So you went to China alone? Where were you born? What type of values did your family give you? How did that affect you growing up as a black woman in the UK? How did that affect your education and employment? How did you heal from the hardship you experienced? If you were in a crowd full of young girls what lesson would you teach them? Do you prefer London or Paris?
TRANSCRIPT
Frederique
Hi Etornam, thank you for taking the time to speak with me today. First, I would like to ask how are you?
Etornam
Loads of stuff to do so I was just busy catching up trying to get things done by the end of the week. So yeah, that’s good.
Frederique
Mmm busy woman! Can you please choose a place that represents the way you feel today and tell us why you chose this place?
Etornam
I’m going to say China. So I’m not sure if you’re aware, but I lived in China for a year in a place called Ningbo, which is in the Zhejiang province on the east coast of China and I remember when I was there, just being very kind of i was i was very humbled while I was being there. And today, I’m in a very kind of sombre humbled new mood. So that’s why I will say that place.
Frederique
Oh, great. So you went in China alone?
Etornam
Yeah. Well, I was studying, yeah.
Frederique
How was that?
Etornam
It was challenging. But it was also a great time, it was really, it was a very humbling experience, because I’ve never been anywhere like that in the world where, you know, they don’t care where you’re from, or anything, they kind of their way or the highway. So I kind of struggled to immerse myself in the culture. But towards the end, I really understood their culture and how they do things and it’s something that I really appreciated in terms of learning about, and, you know, learning that I’m different from someone, but how do I embrace other people’s differences and my differences and how do we work together.
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Etornam
I liked the opportunity to be able to travel to other places. So I was able to go to Hong Kong, I went to Thailand, and went to other places within China and just the excitement of packing a suitcase or a bag to go and explore somewhere was really exciting.
Frederique
And what did you study?
Etornam
So I studied accounting and finance.
Frederique
Was it hard?
Etornam
Yeah, no, yeah, it was very, it was very difficult, you had to put a lot I had to put a lot of effort in to do well.
Frederique
Gosh, you are so courageous. So tell me, where were you born?
Etornam
So, I was born in London.
Frederique
And what type of values your family gave you?
Etornam
Erm, so I grew up in a Christian household and family was very, very important to my family and it was kind of like, oh, be friends with your sisters, before you’re friends of anyone else, very, very rooted in being very, very close knit and being very together and so I would say, that was, you know, a value, the value of integrity and, you know, using, using your emotional intelligence to make the right decision, and also to make sure that you don’t, one of the things that my mum really taught me is to not be someone who is someone who just falls into the background by trying to blend in with everyone, but stand up for what you believe in and stand up for…. yes, stand up for yourself when people try and take advantage of you.
Frederique
And did that affect your experience of living in the UK? As a black woman? I mean,
Etornam
I think so at times, because when I was in school, I would try and stand up for myself. And, and then by standing up for your stuff, people would assume you’re aggressive because you’re a black woman and so, people would take you standing up for yourself and will say that you’re quite in your face. You’re too powerful. Whatever, I’d say. There have been occasions where people have said that, you know, I come across as a no nonsense person. Oh, I come across as if I’m quite bossy, and it’s like, okay, I don’t know where you got that from, but Okay, cool. People would just assumed that if you’re standing up for yourself, you’re just an aggressive black woman as opposed to just standing up for yourself that affected my, my experience living in the UK.
Frederique
Do you think it is very common?
Etornam
I think there’s a mix. Some people don’t really have that.. and they’re okay and some people do. I think apart from my youngest sister, but my two… so I’ve got four sisters. I mean, three sisters, sorry. I am one of four girls. And I would say the oldest three, like, isn’t myself, my sister who comes directly after me and my other sister, we have that experience. But my youngest sister has grown up in an age where things are much more diverse. So it’s not as… you know, she’s encouraged to be a team leader, rather than saying she’s bossy in school.
Frederique
How about education and job wise? How do you feel?
Etornam
I think education was quite, I think being in school was difficult in this country, I think I used to try really hard to fit in and, you know, what I mean, by fitting in was not being like a, like an idiot in terms of, you know, letting people push you over but what I mean by fitting in is try and abide by the rules of the school. So not being a rebel, do my homework on time trying to achieve, even though my teachers would try and say that I can’t really achieve because of my background… so education was quite challenging, I think, the workplace, I’ve been blessed in the work place, because I’ve had really, really good managers. So although I’ve had… I’ve come across individuals who are quite challenging and for the overwhelming majority of the workplaces, I’ve been in I’ve had good managers who have supported me as a black woman, and didn’t really see that I’m a black woman, they see I’m a black woman, but they don’t, you know, they don’t use it against me, they rather use it as a strength.
Frederique
And relationship wise?
Etornam
Well, I didn’t really have any relationships until I met my now husband, I think it was quite difficult. I think from the area I grew up in, it was difficult to meet men who are like me, like minded like myself, so a lot of the black boys in my area didn’t really… so I guess being in that part of London that I grew up in, black people weren’t really respected. So, you know, black women weren’t seen as attractive. They, you know, it’s kind of like, if you’re dating a black woman, you’re dating someone who’s, you know, not necessarily less valued. But that it is not, it’s not something that would excite people. So I didn’t really interact in like relationships before the age of 18 and then when I went to university, I met a lot more, I met a lot more black people who are much more like minded, and were much more proud of their heritage, and which meant I could, like interact with men who find black women attractive, but I didn’t, you know, I didn’t really, I didn’t have any relationships to develop in that sense. But if I was, if I guess I wanted that university, it was a lot, it would have been a lot easier. And so in terms of friendships, I had, so I had really good friends in school. So I think one of the things that I noticed is the black kids kind of stuck together… in school, and again, that was the same at university, you know, black people kind of stuck together. But I was blessed that I could mix. So I didn’t just, you know, kind of do ACS at university, I mixed with my coursemates who were from different backgrounds. Yeah, so I’d mix with, you know, a mix of English people and mixed with Chinese people, I mixed with Asian people, like Indian people, and mix of people from other parts of Africa, and places in South America and America. So, you know, I mixed with a wide range of people at university, I guess you just kind of learn to share your experiences as individuals.
Frederique
And how did you heal from the hardship that you experienced?
Etornam
I became a Christian, born again Christian at University. So I would say, I think the first thing was, my identity in Christ really, really helped and I think I was just around a lot of like minded people who were successful. So when you’re around like minded people who are successful, they make you feel confident about who you are, which means which makes it difficult to be, you know, anxious about yourself.
Frederique
And do you think that a black woman can reach her full potential here in the UK?
Etornam
I think she has to have the resilience to do so. So if you’re a resilient person and you’re prepared to take on the challenges, then absolutely like, you know, keep going keep working. But I think a lot of us sometimes are resilient, we just get tired and we get frustrated and we just get beaten and broken and and just feel down that we just hold you up. This is not worth it and just give up.
Frederique
I agree. And I will add to that, that we need to practice self care.
Etornam
If we don’t look after ourselves very well, yeah, I think we’re not very good at that we’re not very good at being kind to ourselves.
Frederique
I agree. If I had someone to guide me, I think I would have done many things differently. And I wonder, what would you say to your younger self?
Etornam
That’s a good question. I would tell her she’s beautiful, and that she’s smart and she shouldn’t doubt herself and shouldn’t lose confidence in herself. But trust God, that he, you know, everything will work out for her good because she loves God, I would say, don’t care about the externals and the noise and what people think about you, I will say work hard, you know, that is to say that my mum always used to say is, you have to work twice as hard to have half of what they have that I’m really seeing that as a as an adult and so I would just tell her to continue to work hard from a young age, just work hard, work hard, work hard to achieve what you want.
Frederique
That is great. I would love to leave a message to the younger generation and are we thinking perhaps, let’s say you are in front of a crowd full of girls, and you were suppose to do a speech, what would you say to them?
Etornam
I would tell them social media is not real. I would tell them, that beauty is not defined by social media and what Instagram says is beautiful, that’s just a particular type of persons standard of beauty and that you should just see yourself in the light of, you know, I guess how God sees you and know that, to have confidence within yourself that you are a beautiful person. Don’t get too bogged down by what the world is telling you. But you focus on being a person of integrity, as opposed to listening to the world’s fakeness.
Frederique
Thank you so much Etornam, for coming and talk with me today. I really appreciate it. And before closing, I would like to ask you to answer the following questions within your best abilities. Is that all right?
Etornam
Yeah, go for it.
Frederique
London or Paris?
Etornam
London.
Frederique
Lipsticks or eyelashes?
Etornam
Oh, I would say real eyelashes over lipstick so mascara.
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This podcast was edited by Airglow Audio. Find out more at airglowaudio.com. Professional creative audio.
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